Something I saw on Dr. Phil today made me think
(how many awesome thoughts start off with that very statement? tons, i'm sure)
anyway, it was a commercial for Dr. Phil about wives who secretly ruin their husbands finances. and it made me think of two things
1) i worked for a mortgage company part time while i was in college and i will never forget Mr Smith. he came in with his lovely wife to apply for a mortgage to purchase a fabulous South End property. they both earned decent incomes, had a good sum of money saved up in the bank, and their credit was supposedly impeccable. so when Mike, our underwriter, took on the task of granting them a loan, he assumed it was a no brainer. unfortunately, this was not the case. Mike had to call Mr Smith in for a private meeting the following day to explain that the loan could not be granted because Mrs Smith had run up about $70,000 in credit card debt, in both of their names, without his knowledge
(i mean think about when you shop at Macys or Nordstroms or whathaveyou. I remember using my dad's card when i was in high school and no one said boo about the fact that I didn't look like a "james". so this woman had 5 cards in her husband or her and her husband's name and just shopped until there was nothing more to buy)
and he never knew
and they didn't get the fabulous South End property
and it was very sad.
2) my aunt has 2 retail credit cards (Macys and Saks) that my uncle doesnt know about. she has the bill sent to her work office so that he won't know. supposedly it is because he is so cheap but really it is that she is really extravagant and i mean this is ME calling someone else extravagant when she finds something she likes, she buys two...whether it's ankle socks, or a ball gown.
it all has me thinking. when you get married are you obligated to share your finances? what happened with the Smiths was mainly so bad because she had the cards In His Name, and thus ruined his credit while she was ruining her own (which frankly is pretty unconcionable). but if you have your own money, and your own cards...is it share and share alike?
and what my aunt does, it not too bad because she pays the bills with her own money...she just doesn't want to hear my uncle complain about how much she spent on a headband. but it still IS sneaky....
and i am not married but sometimes i find myself lying to Adam about clothing purchases. he will ask me "is that new?" when he sees me in something he doesn't recognize and i might say "no, i just never wear it" when in reality i just ripped the tags off. it's not because i am afraid what i did was wrong, but because we have different ideas of what is a good amount to spend on a piece of clothing. or because i will eat cheese sandwiches from home from a week so i can get this pair of crocodile heels that I Have To Have and Adam thinks i should spend the money on food, perhaps.
so really what i want to know is, can you share your life but not your finances? or is that holding back?
Tuesday, September 06, 2005
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7 comments:
I think it all depends where you are in your life. Like you said you and Adam aren't married. You just moved in together, you are young and as far as I know, there's no actual marriage/baby/house talk going on (in theory yes, we all talk about that, but in reality...not so much haha).
You aren't really saving up for a relationship shared expense big item like, say a house. You both have jobs and make the money to pay your shared rent. And, at this point, unless you are planning a vacation together that requires shared funds, I say save and buy as you wish. It is after all YOUR money.
I could see why it would be an issue if you ARE talking some kind of big joint investment - if you're going to go into it together, you should saved and contribute as equally as your paychecks allow.
But maybe I'm just a cynic, or watched and learned from my mom get screwed over in her divorce - in general, I prefer to keep finances seperate. A joint checking for a married couple (or a similarly invested couple) where both parties are required to contribute equally and it's agreed that the money will go towards shared expenses like a mortgage, bills, vacations - fine. But anything that I've worked for, saved and invested that is not part of the "marriage fund" will always clearly be in my name.
Love always, the divorced kid.
First off, finances are without a doubt, the number one thing Dan and I fight about. Like you and Erin both stated, we have completely different ideas about how much is too much for a cute handbag or a new skirt, or moreover, how many pairs of shoes are too many. I also have been known to use the line, "Oh no, I've had this forever I just forget I have it so I never wear it". We have pretty much everything together, except our credit cards.
When we got married, we pooled our savings together into one bucket and used what we had to on the wedding, so really, what we have in savings is ours together. And that money, is definitely off limits unless speaking with the other person, it's an unwritten and unspoken about rule, yes, but I would be furious if I found out he was dipping into that money without consulting me.
I don't really know how you can have a marriage without combining your money, it would seem too much like a roommate situation if you did otherwise, but I think it is a very good idea to set aside money for your own personal stuff.
When we took a marriage class when we were engaged, there was this couple there that had been married for 45 years who spoke to us. They said the best advice they could give was to set aside, each month, a certain amount of money in your budget for each individual that the other simply has no right to even inquire about. It is theirs to spend, no questions asked. I thought that was great advice.
Suze Orman was on Queer Eye once and talked about a similar issue. Some people assume once you get married you immediately conjoin your accounts and share all wages and costs. She said that's wrong, and instead each spouse should have his/her own account, and then a third account that they share for combined finances. That way you still have some personal freedom while sharing the main finances.
Another interesting point she made was that when you're paying for things like a mortgage, instead of paying equal amounts it's better to pay equal percentages of each person's income. So if one person makes $10,000 less per year, they pay however much less in the finances. Math is hard. But you get the idea. It sounds a little communism-esque, but I think it makes sense within the confines of a family. And not just because I'll probably always make less than my man.
This is way long and probably didn't even address your point. I guess what I'm saying is it's possible to share your life AND your finances, while still holding on to a little bit of financial independence. Or something.
And yeah, I find myself sneaking in a little white lie about recent purchases every now and again. But he knows me too well at this point.
<3Sasky
I think it's a matter of what you agree to up front. If you pool your money, then you have to merge everything else. Therefore, you need to communicate about purchases. If you keep your incomes separate (which I advise) then you are free to use those funds in a more discretionary manner.
-G
I know several married couples that have separate finances but most of them are on their second marriage and have separate accounts for things having to do with kids like child support paid/received etc. Most people in their first marriage just combine everything because it isn't very romantic to have your own stuff, and you don't want to go into a marriage thinking your spouse is going to steal all your money and leave you with bad credit in a divorce. But it does seem beneficial to be able to have some money just for you - it keeps you from feeling guilty about every purchase and there doesn't have to be a discussion about every little thing you want to buy because you might be taking money away from the mortgage payment or something important. The one joint account and one personal account idea seems like it would prevent a lot of arguments while still sharing the major things - plus if you aren't always fighting about the price of a pair of shoes or a set of golf clubs or other fun things, you will probably have a happier relationship.
I think it's best to combine everything. Money is the number one reason people get divorced and the divorce rate is 50%. If you separate things there's always an undercurrent of this is mine and this is yours and I think that creates conflict. If you can't deal with combining your finances I don't see how you can build a life together. Before you get married I think you need to sit down and lay everything on the table, your debt, your income, your goals, and you need to come up with a financial plan. If you aren't ready to be honest and share then I don't think you're ready to be married.
Alena, are you married? I would guess no but I could be wrong. Your idea sounds great in theory but are you currently using that plan? Marriage is more than just sharing money, and finding a compromise tells more about how ready you are. You can still be honest and maintain different accounts.
I tried the combined, share everything, etc plan and my husband and I had world war III all the time. We have different ways of handling money and bill paying. He likes to pay HUGE amounts off and forgets to think about things like...food. I will pay a little over the minimum to ensure we have some leeway if something unexpected comes up. So having separate accounts and bills works for us. It really just depends on the couple.
Now the wracking up $70k in debt in the hubby's name...VERY bad. If you want debt, make it all your own.
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